Thursday, June 24, 2010

Guest Editorial By Ski

Regarding Herb's blog post of June 8, I feel some comments are in order. The "Chamber" by the admission of previous officers and in fact found in their by-laws, is a community activities group, not a business oriented group. To that end they have done a marvelous job with Bayview Daze and the fireworks. I might point out the "Chamber of commerce' name was chosen with the blessing of the national organization- So there would be "prestige" behind the name in dealing with whomever needed dealing with, not that it was business oriented.

I find it ironic and hypocritical that Chan is continually kicked in the teeth by the chamber, through it's agent, the DAC. The chamber for years has used Chan's property and road between JD's and the Bay Cafe with nary an offer of recompense for the use. The chamber then sells space to out of towners for $40, this being a big fund raiser for them. The chamber then uses some of that revenue to finance the DAC activities, some of which is used for kicking Chan in the teeth. Therefor the irony. The last DAC harassment was when Chan was cleaning up around the Bay Cafe and sculpting the terrain. Lo and behold the Lakes Highway District was called by the DAC because of some supposed infraction, and the chamber wonders why they might not be able to use Chan's property for Bayview Daze!

An additional irony is that the businesses are assessed $40 for membership-The citizens only $10- and have no representation by the chamber. This leads me to Kathi's comment regards to businesses not supporting the chamber. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to realize that considering the aforementioned position of the chamber, paying $40 for membership is a bad business decision. Lastly, I agree with Herb that businesses should form their own group, perhaps called the BBA; Bayview Business Alliance. Key word "Alliance."


Anonymous said...

Interesting perspective, Ski. Why don’t you try becoming one of Chan’s floathome tenants? If you think Chan is being harassed, maybe if you were one of his floathome tenants you would take the perspective of “what comes around goes around”. What you don’t understand is that, Chan just loves to play the racially discriminated victim as a ploy to get the uninformed and inexperienced to feel bad for him. He also likes to play the game of “hummm, let me think about it”. Meaning – “I will give my answer at the last possible moment and make them sweat about it”. I understand that the Chamber President approached Chan about using the empty parking lot in the middle of town for booths. I also understand that Chan, via Norma Jean, has not responded to date. Personally, I never would have approached him because I am so familiar with the game he plays. If Chan does allow the booths to be in the parking lot, he will not let anyone from the Chamber Board know his decision until the last possible moment, which is coming quickly. I say put the booths any place but in the parking lot and to heck with it all. Maybe those of you that continue to bash the DAC will someday also know that many of the folks that are on the DAC spend tireless hours getting everything arranged for Bayview Daze and also start planning almost a year in advance for the next celebration. This includes getting the barge prepared with sandbags, cooking for those that spend the entire weekend prior working on the barge, setting up the barge on the Saturday of the fireworks and taking food and drinks out to the volunteers, fundraising, organizing the parades, getting the vender booths set up, the list goes on and God knows what else they do. Don’t tell me Chan doesn’t get anything out of letting the community use of the corner lot that is now Tobler’s. BS – Who do you think picked up all the garbage in the lot and whacked down the weeds so the booths could use the lot the last few years? I know who – George Grandy, Cindy Post and others. Poor Chan! Ski and others, maybe it is time you looked at both sides of the fence and quit throwing rocks. There are two sides to every story and it is not just Chan’s and staff! Frankly, after this year, I say to heck with Bayview Daze completely and let the business owners, such as Chan plan, organize, set up and do all the work that is needed to put something as big as this together so they can continue to get revenue from the crowds that come. Don’t tell me he gets nothing but “kicked in the teeth by the Chamber”. You all are kicking the volunteers, the Chamber and the DAC in the teeth just fine. Keep up the good work and throwing those nice little rocks.

Jamie B

Anonymous said...

Why in all of Bayview’s issues, there is only 1 person that exuberates negative energy like she is mad at the whole world - go figure. As bad as this person makes Bayview or her landlord, I wonder why she still wants to put up with it. She just needs to move on. I haven't heard any other tenant bitching about their landlords? Infact I am happy with Scenic Bay so there you go.

Anonymous said...

You lack experience. Can't move FH's otherwise, I would be at MacDonalds. Not mad, not bitching. Stating the facts. You must be a boater or someone that can move your personal property. Have a beautiful day. Hope you are at the lake enjoying the sunshine and nature. Remember 2 sides to every story. Try and keep that in mind.

Jamie B

Anonymous said...

Well there is always the option of selling the float home if you are that unhappy.

It would be nice if you knew what you were talking about before sending a response to this post. Most of your information is erroneous.

Anonymous said...

WOW wheres the LOVe

Anonymous said...

Erroneous is an understatement - how about an outrageous lie as a discriminated victim as a ploy to get the uninformed and inexperienced to feel bad for her.
There have been several float homes that have moved around in the bay; in fact, movement between Lake Coeur d'Alene and Lake Pend Oreille – I bet Herb can validate this.
So quite lying and pass on bullshit and disenchantments. With your reputation, no marina would likely take your float home so call yourself lucky as your current landlord hasn’t thrown you out yet. I think Macdonalds is laughing at your story. P/S I have a floathome and I am happy at Scenic Bay.

Anonymous said...

Seems to me there is a float home currently at Scenic Bay that was orginally at McDonald's and was moved to Boileau's and then moved to Scenic Bay. FH movement is possible as long as a marina is open to accepting the float home, the marina has the capability and the involved agencies have granted the proper permits.

Anonymous said...

I am current tenant at Scenic Bay and wasn't aware of float home issues. I read Jamie's original comments and started asking around some questions - What is wrong with someone saying "Let me think about it" on a decision he has to make? It is his decision and if you want an answer, it is his choice. If you don't like it, don't ask him. It seems like he is quite successful with that strategy. In fact you might learn from it if you applied a little thinking before you speak as lots of your comments made appears to be false or made up. If you took your time to think thru and check your facts, you too can sound like him.
Your comments about the DAC spends tireless hours getting everything arranged for Bayview Daze including getting the barge prepared, cooking, setting up the barge ....God knows what else they do - sounds like a stretch of imagination. Maybe you should think about it before you wrote this. You are giving the DAC a lot of credit or you are part of the DAC taking lots of credit for someone else’s efforts.
On moving your float house comment, were you trying to pull wool over some eyes. I discovered one float home from Macdonald moved over to JDs. I also heard that you went over to MacDonald’s to ask to move over and he turned you down. So what is the true story Jamie – everything you mentioned seems to be misinformed or twisted. Do you have some personal agenda – disgruntles tenant maybe??

Anonymous said...


I wanted to thank you for presenting how several folks are feeling around this burg called Bayview about the DAC and the Chamber. This is not an isolated case. I personally have talked to many business owners who are afraid to speak their minds in fear of retribution.
It quite possibly time for another group to form or for the current Chamber to re-name the organization to something more appropriate.

Sign me,
A concerned citizen

Anonymous said...

Hi Herb stop in Bayview today to check on the boat stopped at the hook to have lunch! it was good but dead! how are they doing? she said the live intertainment stopped after 2 nights is the Hook cursed or something? it looks great hope they make it Just wanted to say hi and see how things are- although the whole town seemed quite went to the patio and saw no old faces! other than the employees hope the 4th wil bring some good business to the Hook ! and everyone! miss everyone take care Joni Dyas

Bay Views said...

Haven't been able to find you, Joni. Call me any time before midnight or todmorrow. the phone number the office had was disconnected. 683-9107

Bay Views said...

I'll be at the hook from about 11 am to 4 m tomorrow. 683-3900

Mike Lee said...

You really have to see the big picture to understand Bayview politics.
Then judge the characters by their fruits.
The DAC are concerned citizen representing the overwhelming community sentiment to keep our town from becoming Coeur d Alene north. Are they perfect? Of course not, but thank God we have them.
These are fine people who are giving huge amounts of time and money to attend meetings and hearing to keep those who would exploit our town honest. Shame on self-interested individuals who defame them.

Mike Lee said...

And might I add, had the Community Council honored the wishes of the community and addressed the fear of development instead of becoming pro development, perhaps the Chamber would not have had to do it.

Ski and some other past leaders of the Council have fought against the wishes of their own membership over development and that is why they have no one at their meetings. Now they bad mouth the dedicated community members of the DAC. What a joke. They represent everything that is wrong with the politics of self interest and special interests.

Anonymous said...

Well said Mike! As far as responding to the FH comments it is not worth it as these individuals are not identifying themselves. For all I know, these anonymous posts have all come from SBM owners and staff, which brings me to a good question. Herb in several of your blogs you have stated that you will no longer post anonymous comments. Interesting because it seems you decide on the rules when it suits you. Many won't take a risk to speak on the issues on a blog or at a hearing due to retaliation and harassment from business owners, especially from Chan and Bob and believe me I know what that is all about first hand. What the heck are your rules anyway? What is happening here seems very hypocritical to me. Please explain your rules.

Jamie B

Bay Views said...

Jamioe, I spelled out my policy in a post called, "My purpose in blogging. If you scroll down from the first three or four posts, yopu'll find my statement of policy.I printer your attacks on me, because ypou signed you own name. I allow anonymous remarks as long as they are not personal attecks. Those that want to go further MAY be accepted if signed with the authors name. Ski pust his name to his remarks and that is why I printed it. You will find others in the comment section that I printed also that disagreed with Ski. It's quite simple, really. Contest the message, not the messenger. Everyone has an opinion and not all of them agree with each other. Just don't throw too many personal attacks and I'll print them. I just had someone call Ski's remarks a poison pen letter. That would be an extreme example of a difference of opinion.

Anonymous said...

Come on, Mike. One of the main problems in Bayview is that groups get painted with a broad brush. All members of the Council are no more pro-development than all members of the Chamber are anti-development. There are numerous concerns and issues on both sides. The problem lies in disrespecting the opinions and views of our fellow townspeople. We need to learn how to get along!

Mike Lee said...

Sheryl is a board member of the council as is Marlys and they are obviously not pro development. I even like Ski and think he has a great sense of humor.
As for all us getting along, we can dream of a perfect world.
I'm glad the Council exists to keep the Chamber in line on other issues. Or have we forgotten the Ron Mackin chamber that was the reason the Council formed.
I just feel trusting Chan and his "poor me" rhetoric is not in the communities best interests. His employee burning and burying all manner trash at the storage unit showed me his intent towards this community. Oh and JDs is a real asset. Natural beauty and peace and quiet these are the Bayview values we need to develop. We have a jewel that will develop well enough without supporting developers who are adverse to the rules.

Bay Views said...

If any of the more extreme opinionaters wonder why Mike gets published, it is because he attacks ideas not people.

Anonymous said...

I love Bayview, and as a part-time local (we have a slip at the local marina), my husband and I are large supporters to the local economy and typically drop at least $200 a weekend between food, drinks and mercantile purchases. However..... after this weekend we will probably be pulling our purse strings tighter. Here is a brief description of our weekend and where our money went.

Mercantile : no problems here and we love the staff.

Buttonhook: out of hamburgers,cheese sauce, taco meat and milk. Really? How is the main restaurant out of burgers? Prices are too expensive for the quality of food and the music competing from the kitchen and overhead in the restaurant was a nice touch. We can be incredibly forgiving with the food and prices, but the wait staff was young and inexperienced. Almost rude as we were ignored, drinks not brought out and we had to ask for simple things like silverware and condiments. No, it was not busy. We were the 2nd table of two in the entire restaurant. It was such a bad experience that we will not be back for quite awhile. Pity.

The Floating Dock: Why must the bartender tell us he has been fired from every establishment in town, is a past meth addict and slept with some locals wife and hid out in the woods for 6 weeks with his dog to avoid retaliation? Seriously, we don't care and are offended to hear him badmouth every Bay View local. Not to mention his girlfriend should not be pouring her own drinks behind the bar and then complaining he should just shut down and go home because she is bored.

JD's: the flourescent lights, broken smoke eater and hidden dart board is enough to keep us away for awhile too. Too bad, JD's was our favorite watering hole last year.

Ralph's: we had a great experience here today and enjoyed the new outside seating area.

Cafe: Super greasy. Bleh. How about something healthy added to the menu for breakfast? Some of us have bikini's to squeeze into.

Back to the original post of politics. We were sad to see the frontage of the Captains Wheel being measured to see if it would accomodate the vendors for Bayview Daze. We were informed that the past location (parking lot) could not be supported and with the $40 fee fromt the vendors, the chamber is more-less breaking even with the costs and efforts of hosting the celebration.

Between the polictics, drama and crappy food - we are saddened with the negative attitude of many in Bayview and the convenience to blame Chan and Holland. We will come to Bayview as long as we are able, but until the town's attitude towards service, gossip and quality changes, we will keep the majority of meals and cocktails consumed at our dock. Such a shame too, because we would prefer to eat out and support the local businesses. I agree with the original post - can't we all just get along? I believe the actions and decisions of Chan are simply a miscommuncation. Why would someone with so much invested in the town not want to support the biggest event of the year? It sounds more like assumptions, ego and bias to me.

Anonymous said...

Wow ... the masters of Bayview have spoken - Mike Lee and Jamie Berube. Let’s look at the facts - one a tree hugger who has infiltrated the community with a clear mission of natural beauty and peace and quiet. Need to move on to some hills. Ulterior motive of trying to shut down Viking property cause it abut ex girlfriend house and have built a basketball court on Viking's property. Contemplated with people to be able to purchase Viking property for cheap on auction if buyer would not subdivide and he would assure Viking fails. What a model citizen? Or check out his past or Mike senior. Talk to his neighbors - the same all over. A jewel that will develop well enough – for someone who has no stake in any real investment in Bayview speaking about property values and local employment. Demise of Bayview is what it is all about. Oh by the way, majority of Bayview – let’s not use this term loosely as it blows more smoke than facts. There is a silent majority.
On Jamie, read between her lines and check the facts – as blond as they come. On FHs, go around and ask some of the owners including Jamie’s neighbors and get the facts – Lets the facts speak for itself.

Anonymous said...

So you publish attacks on mike lee and Jamie but not on others,hmm
That last post is so bull crap. I find its the cape people advocating development, of course not all, but most, retired and nothing better to do, they,ll just drive through town on there way home so what do they care if there are high risers, since they dont live in the town.Perfect example is Lloyd, lives on cape,bonner county but wants to lead incorporation for bay view, give me break,
herb, you are pro chan so how do you reconcile chan suing Terry Shepard,, she didn't deserve to be treated this way, always helping others, chan never taking care of repairs, and then takes her to court.hmmm

Bay Views said...

A critique of two others that have done some criticizing themselves is not an attack except in your imagination. But then I published your attack on me, so there you are. I am not pro-Chan, I simply got fed up with all of the unjust crap vbeing trown at him andd my sense of injustice kicked in. As far as the legal dispute over an alledged broken lease is concerned, that is between them. I stay out of these kinds of things. I do agree that Terry has done many good things for this community.

It is getting close to when I will shut down comments on this thread. It is getting old, everhyone is hjust choosing up sides and throwing rocks like little children over a critique that many have privately held to be a group that has left the mission it originally had to become an anti-everything bunch. Rather than hunt down egregious vilolations, now it has degenerated into nit-picking stuff like measuring sidewalks, (building inspector work) and damning Chan for removing the eyesores on the corner and landscaping it. If everyone took a step back, dosavowed extremism then things would settle down naturally.

mike lee said...

Sticks and stones, or should I say matches and fake rocks. Of course I have to reply to such incendiary rhetoric and character assassination, not to mention elements of pure fiction.

Global Warming Alert: the blogosphere is blowing hot air :-)

Just glad Herb has his standards;-(

Let's bring up my dead mother too, and who the hell is Mike senior?

I proudly avow tree hugging and profess and undying love for all things natural, including the blessed quietude of Bayview when I can hear my beloved Bayview Creek cascading down into town.
One of the last best places, not to defend it would be a sin of omission even if it is out of selfishness. But this is Bayview and no good deed goes unpunished. Ya gotta love it.

Compliments on the grammar.
Too bad you are chicken to leave your name, I could send some of my "nazi thug" squirrel friends to harass you, or do like the developers and file lawsuits to silence you.

Were you a bully on the school ground, or did your mother not love you?
I forgive you, but this is a pathetic rerun.
I hope Chan knows who you are, you might get a free meal at the Button Hook. I heard Bob liked to hand out $50 bills, is that true? Ya just gotta laugh.

Anonymous said...

Hey Herb, thanks for keeping the thread open. The comments have been interesting and informative.

No point in further rock throwing and hopefully we as a community can move forward in a positive manner.

Norma Jean

Bay Views said...

Just to set the record straight, Chan can't give anyone a free meal at the Buttonhook, because he doesn't own the business, just the building. Also, The post by Ski doesn't call anyone out. Those remarks are from others. Ski gave me the text printed out in long hand. He doesn't own a computer and doesn't have any knowledge of these subsequent events. At this point, I'm pulling the curtain down on this pissing contest. It has gone way past the point that it needed to. All positions have been spelled out. Any further posts are repetitive. Some are bordering on actionable defamation. Remember, if someone sues you for your remarks they can trace your computoer codes, if by court order they are requested. (IP's)

The Always Obliging Bartender said...

To the 'anonymous' short, bobcut-blonde who had so much to review about everything in our town:

I remember you. I was closing up at the time- I even re-opened our kitchen and cooked for you. You had the bacon, provolone grilled chicken sandwich, which both you and your husband enjoyed and- in return- thanked me profusely for.

I opened up to you only because I've seen you so much at other establishments and I felt you contributed enough to the local economy- that theoretically I could consider you locals.
You should be ashamed at utilizing ones personal anecdotes for your own personal gain. It only goes to show that you are not in fact locals, but simply tourists. Our community graciously welcomes out-of-towners, but does not appreciate your blatant defamation of character.

The fact that you have chosen publicly slander me is insulting to say the least. I understand that you did not specifically use my name, but this is a small town with a "Cheers" mentality.
If you are going to attack someone for their past mistakes -and lets be honest, no one has a clean slate, except for Jesus- make sure you have your facts straight. Your disrespect makes is so I truly do not need to justify my life to you, however to appease your public desire, I will do so:
I have been clean from my past for many years, I did not get fired from my past jobs in town (if you're going to post what you hear you should at least bring a pen and paper and get it accurate)

Please note, this is purely to defend your personal attacks on myself, my girlfriend and my employers and is entirely independent from the Floating Patio. The Floating Patio is not represented in my opinion. I, like other citizens of Bayview, appreciate the economic contributions of the Floating Patio to this majestic town.

Ps. I don't need an apology, I've already forgiven you. That's what makes Bayview, Bayview.


Anonymous said...

Whether this will be allowed or not remains to be seen and as Herb posted earlier some of these comments are becoming dangerously close to being libelous.

To the writer who offered the critique on the local businesses. Where were you in January? Or February, March? What right do you have to attack any of us who work to serve and take care of you?

If you have an issue with the food being greasy at the Cafe maybe a suggestion for something different might be appropriate? Somehow I wonder about the comment concerning greasy food since the cook has received compliments because the food is not greasy.

The attack on The Patio employee was unwarranted and unfair. Anyone who tries to improve their life should be applauded.

The Hook is essentially in its infancy and deserves a fair shake.

We are a small town proud of our locale and all of us struggled through this past winter, when the economy was really tough.

Again I ask where were you?

Anonymous said...

Anonymous 6:42AM and Ka-Blam,

Dead on!!!!!!! Thank you for your comments. Have a great 4th as you serve the Bayview community as a whole despite the ongoing negitivity being encountered daily.

Anonymous said...

to the posters who say "just move" regarding floathomes. yes it can, but there has to be a spot in which to move to. nobody is leaving macdonalds; they love it there. if gary said no to jamie, it's because he has no space! we'd leave if there was somewhere to go.

scenic bay FH owner

To *Ka-Blam* said...

Who knows if you'll see this but it needs to be said..

I am truly sorry.

I should stick to arguing with words rather than the entire 'bottle'..

-that one regrettably drunk jerk..